I always figured that Bucky's serum was weaker than Steve's but its compensated with a metal arm.
In Civil War, the Soviets reformulated the serum and injected them into those second generation super soldiers that Zemo ended up finding and killing in the facility. Im the flashback, those soldiers outpowered Bucky.
max10012025-12-31 02:24
They got the same drugs inside of them ....
Wait did you really think he was just a regular guy with a metal arm?
XLB1352025-12-31 02:29
I don't think Bucky is 'way stronger' than Cap, but he's definitely far more than 'just a guy with a metal arm'. He was experimented on, has some version of the serum, and overall trained/used throughout time in far more ways. The metal arm is definitely not just 'it' for him.
benjaminsix62025-12-31 02:33
you are wrong lol
flatscan-krakoan2025-12-31 02:10
Not sure but if Bucky wants to recreate this scene well then…
sarandipity-412026-01-01 04:18
I’m so glad someone said this.
I don’t know if Bucky can do a curl using a helicopter as a dumbbell, but if so I would like to watch.
Batmanswrath2025-12-31 02:12
According to Disney/Marvel scaling, Bucky is stronger and more durable than Cap.
That’s comics though. Movies can be different, for example, Bucky isn't 5ft 9 lmao.
I'm not disagreeing, just saying the links don't prove it for sure
MrZeral2025-12-31 02:52
His metal arm is stronger, we have seen it in Winter Soldier and Civil War when he overpowered Steve with it.
Wtygrrr2025-12-31 02:26
MCU Rogers is a lot stronger than comics Rogers, but Bucky is also a super soldier.
Batmanswrath2025-12-31 02:34
That could well be true, this is the only "official" rankings I can find though. The vibranium arm definitely has to be part of the equation.
Lethal132025-12-31 03:19
Huh thats interesting. I’m a bit of casual watcher but the sentiment I get is that most movie versions are nerfed versions of their comic counterparts
streakermaximus2025-12-31 03:28
For the most part, yeah. After so many years power creep leads to some crazy shit going down.
Officially, Steve Rogers is 'peak' human. If a human can theoretically do it, Steve can do it. Think: Olympic power lifter, gymnast, sprinter, marathon - all in the same body.
Movie Steve is just straight up superhuman.
Lethal132025-12-31 03:36
I think Captain Marvel might be the other one?
I think I remember people saying she’s very different in the movie compared to her powers in the comics. But again not sure if thats true or not
Doright362025-12-31 04:29
Carol is a mix. In the comics she only goes full Binary mode (top strength) when she absorbs a lot of energy from an external source.. like base line she's wonder woman strong but let her eat a sun for breakfast and she's stronger than Superman.
They don't ever really focus on that absorbed power up in the movies. It's there if you look close but they mostly just have her as baseline Superman levels.
shogi_x2025-12-31 07:43
>Caorl
r/UnexpectedWalkingDead
Doright362025-12-31 11:07
Lol. Fingers too fat
chewywheat2025-12-31 04:37
Captain Marvels powers are actually pretty similar to the comics despite having a vastly different origin story.
Her origin story (before the retcon) in the comics was kinda straightforward. During a confrontation between kree soldiers, Carol was basically exposed to a machine that altered her body into a superhero and also hybrid human/kree. This is partly due to her thinking of her mentor Mar-Vell who was the original Captain Marvel superhero in the comic book (who was not just a scientist). She only took up the mantle of Captain Marvel way after the death of Mar-Vell (she has been calling herself Ms. Marvel up until this point).
Q_S22025-12-31 05:09
Right! Ive always wondered this. Even with batman there are things even peak humans cant do. Punching concrete? Damn
Alexexy2025-12-31 04:12
The top tier heroes like Hulk and Thor are weaker. Cap is much, much stronger. Spider Man is unchanged, which would make him one of the strongest characters in the MCU.
skibbidywibbidy2025-12-31 09:47
Yeah Thor and Hulk in the comics are insanely strong/powerful
onepostandbye2025-12-31 03:19
I’ve been reading Cap since the 80s, and this doesn’t seem true. Am I wrong? I could be. Can you elaborate? I always felt like the MCU did a good job of showing that Cap had superhuman strength at that low end where it wasn’t distractingly unbelievable, which is where I mentally placed him in the comics as well.
One thing that might be relevant- comics characters are MUCH more gymnastic than their cinematic counterparts. The magic of panel time and all that. But there is a ton of implied strength in those gymnastics.
Daveaa0052025-12-31 03:55
I thought super soldiers were all essentially the absolute limit of human biology if *everything* went right.
Paladar22025-12-31 04:53
Dude no lol, a perfect human would still not get close to Cap strength. Not even including his insane stamina and regeneration
Traditional-Pear90782025-12-31 06:22
it is peak human performance in the marvel world
Paladar22025-12-31 06:23
Not really lol
Traditional-Pear90782025-12-31 06:35
what do you mean? marvel humans have a much higher threshold for things. e.g. daredevil is just a human but can perform some crazy feats.
captain america’s serum just buffs all his stats to 100. unless you can show me otherwise? “lol”
FerrusManlyManus2025-12-31 07:32
It’s your contention that a strong normal human can chuck a motorcycle as far as Steve did in Ultron. In the MCU. Even though we never saw anyone ever do that.
Traditional-Pear90782025-12-31 09:07
we’re not talking about just strong people. talking about hitting the absolute peak physical human potential.
B00STERGOLD2025-12-31 11:24
Daredevil constantly gets his shit pushed in. He does have superhuman senses and is a mutate.
NK13372025-12-31 06:40
In the comics it’s well established that Cap is basically peak human potential, so much so that Erskine himself *originally* developed a diet and exercise plan that would result in a super solder, the downside being it would require a lifetime of strictly following it and that was too long for the military which is why Erskine began work on the serum later.
But his original plan got passed down his family until his grandson decided to try out that died/exercise theory and raised a kid on it. The result was that child growing up exactly as predicted and becoming the same type of super soldier that cap was. The whole point is that they’re genetically perfect.
That said, MCU cap has been shown to def be super human, but comics cap is and always has been peak human power
Paladar22025-12-31 06:57
Comics Cap has done some superhuman stuff too…
JDeegs2025-12-31 14:44
"Human potential" in comics is beyond anything you could achieve in reality though
NK13372025-12-31 15:15
Everything in comics is beyond anything you could achieve in reality
Citizen_Kano2025-12-31 09:17
Yeah, absolutely nobody in the real world is holding down a helicopter because they hit the gym and eat well
Daveaa0052025-12-31 17:05
Hitting the gym and eating well wouldn't, I would think, take you to the limits of human biological potential
1coudini2026-01-01 06:27
So what apart from lifting weights and eating to support strength gains would take you to the limits of human biological potential?
Daveaa0052026-01-01 20:29
Having muscles that get rid of lactic acid almost instantly instead of the time it normally takes.
machogrande22025-12-31 19:45
Or kicking even a small car and making it slide.
Daveaa0052025-12-31 17:04
What's your reference point for a perfect human?
Paladar22025-12-31 17:32
They’ve literally done studies on this, you can go check. There’s a limit to what the body can do and it’s not nearly as high aa you think. Cap ran at like 100kph in the tunnel in Civil war, top speed of Usain Bolt is barely half that. That’s not even talking about strenght and regeneration. He can’t even get drunk because of his metabolism, thats super human lol
Daveaa0052025-12-31 18:46
The conceit behind the "super soldier" I think is all of the limits being reached at once.
So Bolt is the fastest man, but he doesn't have muscles that regenerate as fast as possible, or blood cells that carry as much oxygen as possible, or yatta yatta.
I agree it all amounts to being "super human" because without the magic serum, while a person might be able to push themselves extremely far through training, they couldn't have their baseline biological processes all functioning as effectively possible at the same time.
Wrong-Vermicelli47232025-12-31 22:01
Comics sure, mcu no
Parlett3162025-12-31 04:02
MCU Cap is more on the lines of Ultimates Cap for strength and speed
onedickpunch2025-12-31 05:31
Can you explain why the human torch has a durability of 6?
masterionxxx2025-12-31 11:38
Stats-wise marvel.com is really terrible, Natasha is given the same stats as Steve ( despite her Super Soldier Serum being explicitly inferior to Steve's one ).
Well, I don’t think he’d have much of a chance with only one arm, unless he managed to straddle the helicopter skid and hang onto something with his only arm.
streakermaximus2025-12-31 03:29
He has a metal arm? That's awesome!
CityNo17232025-12-31 04:16
Oh, I’ll get that arm.
MaxReb02025-12-31 05:31
I understood those references!
Heavensrun2025-12-31 10:33
I understood *that* reference!
simiansamurai2025-12-31 04:17
Oh I'll get that arm!
CaptainFlash692025-12-31 20:23
You probably didn’t notice him with his metal arm
Swimming-Young-262025-12-31 02:31
Bucky is much stronger, it’s just not shown in the movies what he can do.
In Thunderbolts he flips a moving truck, so there’s that.
John Walker is probably also stronger than Steve
DCangst2025-12-31 02:59
Considering the jump we saw Walker do in Thunderbolts (compared to Steve in the elevator shaft), I'm going to agree with that assessment.
As for Bucky and the helicopter -- yes. He could. He's got a version of the serum and a vibranium arm. He could easily bend that yellow rail, as well (and the yellow rail is standing up just fine, which indicates the level force is less than Bucky or Steve's maximum strength).
demonoddy2025-12-31 03:30
Presumably they have a better version of the serum
BlazeReborn2025-12-31 02:50
Man that's gotta be one hell of a bicep curl.
NorthDakota2025-12-31 19:45
No one in this thread talking about the railing with tiny screws into concrete which is able to withstand that force. I think it's unlikely. woulda busted off for sure.
BlazeReborn2026-01-01 23:51
Not if you use [Nagarjuna Cement.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95-KgsbjZ_s)
Responsible-Middle352025-12-31 03:19
The arm would come off, don't ya think?
ShawshankHarper2025-12-31 04:04
I wondered if he learned that during his tenure as the winter soldier or if he picked that up post civil war.
Ok_Confection_102025-12-31 21:41
He learned it when it was removed from by the the Wakandan soldiers during their tv show
Meriwether12025-12-31 03:20
Not only does he have a metal arm, he is also a super soldier. Probably stronger than cap
BruceDSpruce2025-12-31 03:30
Did the approx math …
- Cap preventing the lift of an average helicopter (5500lb) would be exerting around 24500N.
- Bucky to stop a 5500kg (per specs) armored Humvee going at least 60mph, to stop within 3 meter, according to the Thunderbolts scene, would be around 667,000N.
Cap could definitely been using more force, as the helicopter could have been heavier or have more thrust, but Bucky showed he’s easily in the same category as Steve in terms of raw strength (if not much stronger) from the Thunderbolts escape scene.
Ok-disaster20222025-12-31 03:40
Stopping that truck wasn't raw force though. He punched his vibranium arm into the ground/road as an anchor point.
BruceDSpruce2025-12-31 03:51
The Humvee had at least over 2,000,000N of opposing force. The 667kN of force is not the raw force, it’s the stoppage. Any way you math it … Bucky conservatively produced a ridiculous amount of force.
Scion417902025-12-31 16:23
Vibranium makes it weird though. That metal invalidates physics
LittleDarkHairedOne2025-12-31 19:32
What's most impressive in that scene, to me, is the Humvee's winch not tearing off!
I'm not really well versed in these things but I have to assume the bolts would shear off at not even half the raw force there?
ugluk-the-uruk2025-12-31 23:12
Didn't he also like shoulder check a car at the end of the movie?
iconboy2026-01-01 16:40
FUCK I'm so happy someone pointed this out!!!!
Alexexy2025-12-31 04:16
Bucky's arm has always been depicted as being much stronger than Steve. Most of Bucky's strength feats have been done with his arm, and any physics based stuff can kinda be written off since his arm is now made of vibranium.
poopoobuttholes2025-12-31 12:06
But you see, the thing is, he switched from pronated to a supinated grip and activated his biceps instead of using his lats. Therefore Steve thought stopping the chopper was too easy and decided to fuckin aura farm instead.
z4guy2025-12-31 16:19
Not to get all gym bro nerdy lol, but he actually did mixed grip, which was the smartest thing he could’ve done. His grip would’ve failed him before his back or arms would’ve. Plus the helicopter was trying to move up, so having his anchor hand be supinated gave him better leverage.
whitepanda20102026-01-03 20:54
This guy grips
BrunsonBurner992025-12-31 19:38
Did this account for the momentum of the helicopter?
Icybubba2026-01-01 03:26
r/theydidthemath
LeoLaDawg2025-12-31 03:39
I always questioned the joint strength. Yeah he's strong but the weak points are the connective areas. Helicopters ripping that right apart.
No_Nature64302025-12-31 04:46
vibranium
YOUDOGEYOU3052025-12-31 04:12
Didn’t he cold stop a bullet proof limo traveling at top speed. Steve struggled to hold that chopper. Bucky didn’t even flinch.
NoX21422025-12-31 14:59
No? He stopped the humvee with the tow chain. The limo was stopped because of the grenade bomb thing he shot at it.
YOUDOGEYOU3052025-12-31 18:51
You are correct my friend!
semperknight2025-12-31 04:18
Caps real strength has never been in his muscles. It's his ability to strategize, to lead, strength of will, and to do what's right no matter what the cost.
The Avengers fighting together are an insanely tough fight for any bad guy. But lead as a team by Cap who is having them chain attacks off each other (like when Hulk pushes sharp metal in that giant floating creature and Thor hammers it in, and when Iron Man lands next to him and fires his blaster as Caps shield who uses it to laser a bunch of enemies at once)....they are *unbeatable*. No matter how prepared you are for a fight, nothing you can do will prepare you for the heroes chaining attacks in unconventional ways.
unsupported2025-12-31 04:41
I just thought about this question. Steve was transformed from a 90 pound weakling, into a 6'+ muscle bound hunk, but there wasn't such a profound physical transformation for Bucky and Walker. Discuss.
No_Nature64302025-12-31 04:46
they didn’t need it
aaufooboo2025-12-31 05:24
I *thought* this was addressed (MCU-wise) in either Agent Carter or another show like Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Essentially, the serum that anyone **other** than Steve rogers didn't have the physical change part. As a matter of fact, it is that part that made the hydra trials and other trials so lethal. They couldn't figure out how Dr. Erskrine did it.
Someone can fact check me, but I am 90% confident this question came up in a show and was addressed.
defragc2025-12-31 06:39
Steve received Vita Rays and they didn’t. They also had later formulas that didn’t add bulk.
B00STERGOLD2025-12-31 11:36
Captain Carter should have had more bulk
sarandipity-412026-01-01 04:21
~~Bucky was also a hunk.~~
Sorry, fangirling here.
But he was pretty ripped in TWS and Civil War. I don’t think the HYDRA serum added height or as many dramatics though.
SilverSurferson2025-12-31 05:53
Cap is a super soldier, the second if I'm not mistaken
Apollo_Sierra2026-01-01 03:47
Yeah, first was Red Skull.
JOliverScott2025-12-31 07:42
I think Bucky's metal arm is strong enough but it would detach so the feat in question isn't feasible for him. Let him stop a speeding Humvee though and let's see Cap top that!
Longjumping-Salad4842025-12-31 10:00
no. only for the movies
SuitablePeach-2025-12-31 11:08
I’d like to see him try👀
Character_Mind_6712025-12-31 12:41
John walker: strongest (overpowered bucky easily)
Bucky barnes: most durable (jumped out of a plane and kept working)
Red guardian: quickest back in his prime (fought taskmaster evenly, caught up with a plane, stopped a falling boulder)
Steve rogers: all rounder (slightly faster and stronger than bucky during the knife fight.)
Snow-Gecko2025-12-31 14:49
Minecraft steve
Rofl-Cakes2025-12-31 14:54
Why he look like Steve here?
redwolve3782025-12-31 14:54
My colleague and I did the math about two years ago.
The conclusion we came to was;
He is not pulling the helicopter down. He is preventing it taking off, acting as an anchor. Therefore, Bucky should be able to do the same if not somewhat better due to the metal prosthetic.
BuckyRea12025-12-31 15:09
You mean Arm-Fall-Off-Boy?
Mario-Speed-Wagon2025-12-31 16:10
Made my buddy so mad when I was pretending argue this scene with him
“It’s like holding a boat to a pier, it’s easy anyone could do that.”
JimmyEllDubya2025-12-31 19:58
Definitely. Bucky started from a much higher base point before getting the serum, and assuming that Hydra serum really is “fancy” like Red Guardian comments in Thunderbolts.
lordCanti082025-12-31 20:19
IMO Bucky could hold on with his arm but his body will rip apart. The rest of his body is not as durable as Cap's.
SlashOfLife52962025-12-31 20:24
Safe to say anyone with super strength in the MCU should be able to beat a helicopter
Ultron_Sentry_092025-12-31 21:15
Probably not, but I could easily do it.
AzureFWings2025-12-31 21:56
Considering in the breaking out sequence, a few shot of winter solider over powered cap with brute force, I think he defo can but only it’s metal arm
Wrong-Vermicelli47232025-12-31 22:00
Winter soldier strength is extremely inconsistent, so yes and no
sarandipity-412026-01-01 04:25
Schrodinger‘s strength.
Bucky can easily swat an SUV away but don’t ask him to open the door for some senators.
OmarDaily2026-01-01 23:09
I think his metal arm would pop out of the socket..
IronBuzzo2026-01-02 06:31
Idk if you know but Chris actually got hurt doing that stunt - small bicep injury
VerbalChains2026-01-03 03:38
Yes. Winter Soldiers biological arm is just as strong as Steve’s, because he took the super soldier serum, and his vibranium arm is much stronger. Not only could he do it, he could do it more easily.
Commentaires
https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudios/comments/1pzsdek/is_winter_soldier_strong_enough_to_pull_down_the/nwu3e5l/
In Civil War, the Soviets reformulated the serum and injected them into those second generation super soldiers that Zemo ended up finding and killing in the facility. Im the flashback, those soldiers outpowered Bucky.
Wait did you really think he was just a regular guy with a metal arm?
I don’t know if Bucky can do a curl using a helicopter as a dumbbell, but if so I would like to watch.
https://www.marvel.com/characters/winter-soldier-bucky-barnes/in-comics
https://www.marvel.com/characters/captain-america-steve-rogers/in-comics
I'm not disagreeing, just saying the links don't prove it for sure
Officially, Steve Rogers is 'peak' human. If a human can theoretically do it, Steve can do it. Think: Olympic power lifter, gymnast, sprinter, marathon - all in the same body.
Movie Steve is just straight up superhuman.
I think I remember people saying she’s very different in the movie compared to her powers in the comics. But again not sure if thats true or not
They don't ever really focus on that absorbed power up in the movies. It's there if you look close but they mostly just have her as baseline Superman levels.
r/UnexpectedWalkingDead
Her origin story (before the retcon) in the comics was kinda straightforward. During a confrontation between kree soldiers, Carol was basically exposed to a machine that altered her body into a superhero and also hybrid human/kree. This is partly due to her thinking of her mentor Mar-Vell who was the original Captain Marvel superhero in the comic book (who was not just a scientist). She only took up the mantle of Captain Marvel way after the death of Mar-Vell (she has been calling herself Ms. Marvel up until this point).
One thing that might be relevant- comics characters are MUCH more gymnastic than their cinematic counterparts. The magic of panel time and all that. But there is a ton of implied strength in those gymnastics.
captain america’s serum just buffs all his stats to 100. unless you can show me otherwise? “lol”
But his original plan got passed down his family until his grandson decided to try out that died/exercise theory and raised a kid on it. The result was that child growing up exactly as predicted and becoming the same type of super soldier that cap was. The whole point is that they’re genetically perfect.
That said, MCU cap has been shown to def be super human, but comics cap is and always has been peak human power
So Bolt is the fastest man, but he doesn't have muscles that regenerate as fast as possible, or blood cells that carry as much oxygen as possible, or yatta yatta.
I agree it all amounts to being "super human" because without the magic serum, while a person might be able to push themselves extremely far through training, they couldn't have their baseline biological processes all functioning as effectively possible at the same time.
https://www.marvel.com/characters/black-widow-natasha-romanova/in-comics
Well, I don’t think he’d have much of a chance with only one arm, unless he managed to straddle the helicopter skid and hang onto something with his only arm.
In Thunderbolts he flips a moving truck, so there’s that.
John Walker is probably also stronger than Steve
As for Bucky and the helicopter -- yes. He could. He's got a version of the serum and a vibranium arm. He could easily bend that yellow rail, as well (and the yellow rail is standing up just fine, which indicates the level force is less than Bucky or Steve's maximum strength).
- Cap preventing the lift of an average helicopter (5500lb) would be exerting around 24500N.
- Bucky to stop a 5500kg (per specs) armored Humvee going at least 60mph, to stop within 3 meter, according to the Thunderbolts scene, would be around 667,000N.
Cap could definitely been using more force, as the helicopter could have been heavier or have more thrust, but Bucky showed he’s easily in the same category as Steve in terms of raw strength (if not much stronger) from the Thunderbolts escape scene.
I'm not really well versed in these things but I have to assume the bolts would shear off at not even half the raw force there?
The Avengers fighting together are an insanely tough fight for any bad guy. But lead as a team by Cap who is having them chain attacks off each other (like when Hulk pushes sharp metal in that giant floating creature and Thor hammers it in, and when Iron Man lands next to him and fires his blaster as Caps shield who uses it to laser a bunch of enemies at once)....they are *unbeatable*. No matter how prepared you are for a fight, nothing you can do will prepare you for the heroes chaining attacks in unconventional ways.
Someone can fact check me, but I am 90% confident this question came up in a show and was addressed.
Sorry, fangirling here.
But he was pretty ripped in TWS and Civil War. I don’t think the HYDRA serum added height or as many dramatics though.
Bucky barnes: most durable (jumped out of a plane and kept working)
Red guardian: quickest back in his prime (fought taskmaster evenly, caught up with a plane, stopped a falling boulder)
Steve rogers: all rounder (slightly faster and stronger than bucky during the knife fight.)
The conclusion we came to was;
He is not pulling the helicopter down. He is preventing it taking off, acting as an anchor. Therefore, Bucky should be able to do the same if not somewhat better due to the metal prosthetic.
“It’s like holding a boat to a pier, it’s easy anyone could do that.”
Bucky can easily swat an SUV away but don’t ask him to open the door for some senators.