What's a Better Climax for the MCU's Mutant Saga? House of M v. Dark Phoenix
It's no secret that after Secret Wars Marvel plans to delve into the Mutant Saga. However, we don't know what "Avenger's Level" or equivalent movies they have planned. I've seen people want Avengers vs. X-Men, but it seems like at least some of that will be covered in Avenger's Doomsday and Secret Wars. They also could adapt the Genosha or Krakoa attacks, but I feel they will do a large scale galaxy wide conflict involving the Avengers.
Thus, I think we could potentially see House of M or the Dark Phoenix. House of M where Scarlet Witch infamously says "No More Mutants" almost wiping the mutant gene out of existence. I think this could happen as although parts were adapted in Multiverse of Madness, Elizabeth Olsen (Wanda's Actress) has spoken publicly many times about how she wants to say that line and do that arc. With the X-Men coming, it's prime opportunity.
The Dark Phoenix saga, where Dark Phoenix Jean becomes an Cosmic Avengers level threat is such an emotionally strong arc. It's one of the most popular arcs in Marvel comics. We have seen some iteration of Dark Phoniex adapted in pretty much every X-Men portrayal Jean is in. I'm leaning more towards Dark Phoenix given that Marvel has expressed it will dive more into space and there are rumors we may see the Shi'ar.
What do you want the climax of the MCU's mutant Saga to be?
Thus, I think we could potentially see House of M or the Dark Phoenix. House of M where Scarlet Witch infamously says "No More Mutants" almost wiping the mutant gene out of existence. I think this could happen as although parts were adapted in Multiverse of Madness, Elizabeth Olsen (Wanda's Actress) has spoken publicly many times about how she wants to say that line and do that arc. With the X-Men coming, it's prime opportunity.
The Dark Phoenix saga, where Dark Phoenix Jean becomes an Cosmic Avengers level threat is such an emotionally strong arc. It's one of the most popular arcs in Marvel comics. We have seen some iteration of Dark Phoniex adapted in pretty much every X-Men portrayal Jean is in. I'm leaning more towards Dark Phoenix given that Marvel has expressed it will dive more into space and there are rumors we may see the Shi'ar.
What do you want the climax of the MCU's mutant Saga to be?
Commentaires
The x-men were my first comic book movies as a kid - I had no idea about the comics just saw the movies and had the such blast. looking back I still have that sweet nostalgia while still seeing the issues now knowing the source material. HOWEVER it is inexcusable to go from X-Men: First Class to X-Men: Apocalypse. Zero. You could feel they didn’t wanted to be there - and not just J. Lawrence... X-Men 97 is such a breath if fresh air! I really hope the fired writer wasnt the one to carry the show and season 2 will be as fire as season 1… I have doubts.
Maybe. But we have ample evidence that people tend to very much NOT do it right. Let it lie for a good while. Try another Apocalypse, House of M, or any other options. Phoenix needs to be put to rest for now.
Then they follow it up with the actual Dark Phoenix Saga with the full introduction to the Hellfire Club/Inner Circle; Sebastian Shaw/Black King, Emma Frost/White Queen, Harry Leland, Donald Pierce, and Mastermind. Mastermind continues manipulating Jean Grey and she becomes the Black Queen of the Hellfire Club briefly. Until she eventually snaps and turns into the Dark Phoenix. Then the film more or less plays out the main beats of the comic.
Trying to change the story and doing an adaptation without the key characters/story has resulted in robbing the emotional stakes of the story. And being poorly done. Also the X-Men films hadn't exactly written Jean Grey very well before she became Dark Phoenix. Who cares if the film doesn't treat Jean Grey as a more fleshed out 3 dimensional and well-written character and show her importance to the X-Men instead of telling us? Or they don't properly explore what the Phoenix/Dark Phoenix entity is and just rush through the story. That is why Dark Phoenix has failed as an adaptation. Twice. I'm convinced it cannot be done in just one film.
With a Plot Twist, have the MCU Spider-Man be the reason why this happens:
- Have the MCU Symbiote Spiderman kill the MCU Doctor Strange along with Famke Janssen's Jean Grey (Lady Phoenix).
- Because Fox's Jean Grey is dead, have the Phoenix force possessing the MCU Symbiote Spiderman & get rid of that symbiote from him. Then...
- Have the Spider Phoenix kills Sony's entire Spidey villains at first. But since the remnants of the symbiote is still inside Peter Parker & somehow corrupting the Phoenix force, this would lead into...
- Peter Parker (Tom Holland) becoming the Dark Phoenix Spider-Man & he begins to kill Sony's fucked up Amazing Spider-Man (Andrew Garfield) along with Sony's fucked up Spidey projects, MCU She-Hulk, MCU Ironheart, MCU Moon Knight, Spider-Man 2099 (BtSV), Fox's Deadpool (Ryan Reynolds) along with Captain HYDRA & Shathra. And finally...
- Have the MCU Hawkeye girl Kate Bishop shoot the MCU Spider-Man in the back of his neck with an electric arrow, in order to stop him & have the Phoenix force leave him then move into another variant of younger Jean Grey. As for the symbiote, have it find a poor black person named Eddie Brock so he'd be the MCU Venom.
And that's how the Dark Phoenix saga will start with the MCU Spider-Man as it's 1st vessel (due to it goes corrupted by the remnants of the symbiotes inside Peter Parker). Your thoughts about this idea?
Not if they literally didn’t exist, which was the joke I was making, but my bad
With that being said, people would have at least had stories of mutants before they disappeared. If we say there just weren't that many, then House of M seems a little less powerful as a feat. I was thinking there were more mutants in the lab her and Pietro were trapped in and maybe she inadvertently killed them all or made them cease to exist, but that wouldn't be as cool.
If they do House of M and make it so that no one even remembers that mutants existed, that would be crazy. There could be something going on with Dr. Strange's forgetting spell that makes people remember a time where mutants did exist, but that would be a huge bomb to drop with no precursor.
>Wanda would have had to have had a problem with mutants to begin with and they would have to have been prominent for her to get rid of every single one
Unless she was a child and had a bad relationship with someone, perhaps a parental figure I mean who KNOWS who I could be talking about, who does very morally questionable things under the pretense of fighting for mutants. Then it’s very easy to understand why said child with reality warping abilities would get rid of all the mutants, because she didn’t know better and didn’t know what she was doing.
I feel like you’re grasping to a literal interpretation of house of M as the story were telling, where Wanda erases *most* of the mutants, where I’m suggesting the slight tweak that she erased *all of them*, which would explain the lack of MCU mutants. Im not necessarily saying we do a “house of m movie” im saying use the events of house of m to explain the state of the MCU. You haven’t heard stories because they were erased from existence. I’m not sure how this softens the feat when it’s explicitly more powerful than what she did in the comics lol.
It also sets up doomsday/secret wars, where other universes WITH mutants cross over, to point out that the main MCU continuity is the odd one out and something is “wrong.”
TLDR daddy magneto is a big meanie and Wanda, who we’ve seen has “accidentally” used her reality warping several times, naively erases the thing that magneto constantly fights for from reality, but again not a super serious suggestion, was just throwing mud at the wall
Yeah it’s obviously not a perfect 1:1 but since the actual house of m event was so intrinsically tied to memory (namely wolverines) I figured the memories changing was a given. Basically, hit the big points (Wanda changes reality, someone (could even be AU Wolverine still) realizes things are off, Wanda got rid of mutants, etc, just shuffled around a lil
Basically mutant age of Ultron lol
Just showing appreciation you understood
Which is a shame because comparing the Claremont/Byrne masterpiece to House Of M is comparing the Mona Lisa to doodles I did when I was 5.
Still, with Disney doing more and more stories that tie into "newer" comics, and with the direction they appear to be going, I suppose House Of M is more likely.
My first reaction is to assume I will not watch that story line. But, then I remember that the Civil War movie was WAY better than the idiocy Millar wrote, so....
I mean, the title just sells itself
We had the Dark Phoenix already. Twice. Neither worked.
And more Wanda is ALWAYS a treat.
I don't know. Something like that? 🤷🏽
They've tried and failed twice now. I see no reason to do it again. Just let Jean be powerful. She can even have the Phoenix Force. We don't need to do the whole song and dance a third time. There are lots of other big climactic stories that they can adapt, most of which would also have a far greater, more interesting long-term impact on the world and characters not named Jean or Scott.
Wanda says "No, more mutants." and that will be how they introduce all the mutants into the MCU.
It leads to all the Messiah stuff
as such if they choose to implement it, this should be without Wanda (as she burns in hell forever) and the start of a big Messiah arc.
Once we’ve seen a story where mutants are introduced, mutants are established as the underdog, then the mutants come out on top, then they can try to recapture some of the stories from the OG comics/movies, because at that point the mutants will have faced a lot of the hardship necessary to establish some of those storylines.
(2) given the chatter about supernatural stuff, inferno could bring together the mutant and non-mutant stories.
A) They’re not going to pull a ‘let’s get rid of all mutants’ only like 3 phases after they’re introduced.
B) Wanda’s kinda sorta had a villain turn TWICE now. We do not need a rehash of that for a third time.
To say im excited would be an understatement.
Making it look like the mutants killed the Avengers *chefs kiss*. And it leaves mutates like Spiderman behind too.
A year-ish of movies in a world with no Avengers where the mutants "are to blame".
Then bringing them back about a year later with Franklin Richards in another movie; Avengers: Survivors - with the team made up of "accepted" mutants and mutates and any Avengers not on Earth at the time of the previous movie.