One thing that sets the Thunderbolts apart from other MCU movies is how they finally became heroes, not that they 'defeated' an antagonist.
Basically every MCU movie to date has had a specific villain that the hero, or heroes, must defeat. Red Skull, Ultron, Killmonger, Thanos, etc. They always lead to some climactic battle, and with the exception of Infinity War, the resolution sees the hero defeat the villain. The biggest moments for these heroes is the ultimate defeat of their villain.
I know there can be arguments made that Valentina, Sentry, and the Void are 'villains'. We see this team fight some Valentina's underlings and win, sure, but when they go up against Sentry they're outclassed. Their big moment isn't the defeat of villains like in other movies, the Thunderbolts' biggest moment in this movie (imo) is the part where they work together to save all of those civilians, and then when they are able to save their friend Bob.
They defeat Valentina in the sense that they 'own' her, and they defeat Sentry/Void by bringing him back to the light. But their big moment isn't fighting and defeating the villain, it's saving the civilians and saving their friend.
What do you think? Do you agree, maybe just a little?
I know there can be arguments made that Valentina, Sentry, and the Void are 'villains'. We see this team fight some Valentina's underlings and win, sure, but when they go up against Sentry they're outclassed. Their big moment isn't the defeat of villains like in other movies, the Thunderbolts' biggest moment in this movie (imo) is the part where they work together to save all of those civilians, and then when they are able to save their friend Bob.
They defeat Valentina in the sense that they 'own' her, and they defeat Sentry/Void by bringing him back to the light. But their big moment isn't fighting and defeating the villain, it's saving the civilians and saving their friend.
What do you think? Do you agree, maybe just a little?
Commentaires
I’d also argue strange’s actions weren’t particularly heroic. It was arguably risky as he was placing a big assumption the time stone would work how he hoped, but providing that proved true, there was really no sacrifice on his part as worst cases he’s either trapped for eternity, dying to dormamu or earth being destroyed. It was more clever than heroic.
There are a few other MCU movies that have tried to go the path of not simply destroying the bad guy and that making them heroes. The first Black Panther movie is a good example where T’Challa tries to convince N’Jadaka that he can help rehabilitate him, but he winds up killing himself
No Way Home is another example of trying to save bad guys because they’re suffering from mental health issues tied in with their powers, or at least some of them are (the electricity nor the sand were making Electro and Sandman evil). The problem with this movie is that emotional intelligence and compassion didn’t really save the day, random macguffins did
And of course, Multiverse of Madness is the antithesis to the entire point of Thunderbolts*. Oh, someone insanely powerful is suffering from a mental health crisis and not entirely in control of their actions? Nothing we can do for them, let’s hope we sabotage their mental state enough so they wanna end their own lives
It’s hard to say though, that Wanda was too far gone, because Strange wrote her off as a lost cause almost instantly, which is somewhat ironic, since he eventually approved of Spidermans attempts to rehabilitate supervillains from other universes in NWH, even if keeping them alive might fundamentally alter the timelines of their realities
So you’d think he would’ve learned something from that experience
The more classical good guy fights bad guy who is similar to the good guy can have "real movie" moments, but it's also the default option if you don't have a message to get across.
Well, the first GotG movie and The Suicide Squad at least.
And also when she helped Sentry/Bob (was he called Bob?) which I think connects to what Hawkeye did for Natasha - and Echo, and Yolanda herself to a degree.
A big part of being an Avenger is the fighting yes. But there’s also the minimising civilian causalities, and quite a bit of in the field psychological counselling.
Fight the villains. Protect the people. Help the troubled, powerful, and dangerous person to be their best self.
its actually brilliantly written
Even working under Valentina, the end results were generally heroic leaning. They were just tasked with the dirty, shadowy parts. She wasn't some villain trying to accomplish villain things. She was working for the betterment of the US. Her trying to kill them was just her covering her tracks. She didn't even have some sort of actual hatred or animosity towards them. I'm not even sure why she felt she had to get rid of them. They seemed to be loyal. And any path that takes someone from them to her would still exist.
It makes zero sense to me that Val is someone who can be owned. But that's a rant for another thread.