What do you want in the Winter Soldier and Red Guardian dynamic?

I really like the idea that RG thinks Bucky is really cool, but I would like to see Bucky think RG is an all around good guy. Bucky lived poorly through the Cold War and RG did relatively well. Also, RG and Bucky have these competing, but complimentary views of Rogers that I think would be good for each other.

Theur moment in the Uhaul had potential but was probably kept short for runtime priorities.

I'm saying I want them to be friends. Like fist bump friends (though Bucky would sort of tolerate it, while RG would celebrate it) - generally on the same page, but from slightly different positions.

Your thoughts?

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silverBruise_322025-10-07 16:19

But Red Guardian is not an all around good guy. He's the guy who willingly sold out two girls who he'd been raising to the Red Room without the slightest bit of hesitation, or remorse. He's the guy who spent decades working for an authoritarian regime and never blinked an eye. Those days are a source of nostalgia for him, not shame. What does that say about him?

Red Guardian is an absolute piece of shit. The narration refuses to acknowledge it because Feige likes David Harbour, but his actions, his life, speak for themselves. I get why Natasha, or even Yelena, might be too close to the situation to call him out properly, but Bucky should know better. I'd like to hear someone tell Alexei: "You are garbage made flesh", and have it actually stick. That might as well be Bucky, since he's probably familiar with the inner workings of the Red Room.

Edit: I don't think it'll matter much, anyway, since I think at least one, if not both of them, will die in Secret Wars, or even Doomsday

rebeldream2025-10-07 16:27

And then imprisoned by that same regime. Honestly sounds a lot like Isaiah Bradley.

silverBruise_322025-10-07 16:28

Not like Isaiah at all. We don't even know why Alexei was imprisoned

Chemical_Rice_61232025-10-07 21:25

He and Melina weren't willingly raising Yelena and Natasha. They were all undercover spies commissioned to do a job. Natasha knew what was going on because she already had gone through training cycles, Yelena was way younger and innocent and unfortunately had grew attached to her "parents". Unfortunately, the girls would returned to the Red Room, either it'd take them 3 months or 3 years. Although Melina in the intro seemed like she was probably thinking about not finishing the mission and maybe run away. When he left the girls to take them away he looks like he's second guessing he's decision while holding Yelena's toy, but Dreykov reassured him that they'd be ok. He ended up imprisoned because he was "too much noise" for Dreykov, shortly after the Ohio mission.

Tbh, him and Yelena could have easily grow apart and never associate with eachother ever again, but both in BW & TB, Yelena calls him out and he's listening to her, they are honest with eachother. He's clearly flawed and brutally honest when serious. Can't see him totally as garbage person, coward for sure, Natasha was right.

silverBruise_322025-10-07 21:32

They were still raising them. They'd been with the girls for years, and they still didn't care. What does that say about them as people? The girls didn't have to be given over - USSR had fallen, and there was chaos. They could have defected. They knew what Dreykov was. They knew the girls would not be OK. Melina, especially, would have known.

He doesn't really listen, and, again, he doesn't really feel bad about what he'd done. He is scum.

Chemical_Rice_61232025-10-07 21:44

I won't disagree on that, but I see both Alexei and Melina from the lens of brainwashed weapons of the Red Room. Yelena and Natasha broke the curse and wanted to be better people despite their past. Alexei and Melina just stayed in the past, and their screenwriting doesn't redeem them at all.

silverBruise_322025-10-07 21:50

I agree on the difference between the two pairs, and I do think that there's a theme of generational differences at play there. But I disagree that the screenwriting doesn't redeem them - or tries to, at least. The girls still call them mom and dad (and that's especially true for Yelena and Alexei), and we are supposed to see them as their parental figures. He's meant to be a "funny, dopey dad" type character, not an abusive parent.

Chemical_Rice_61232025-10-07 22:02

yeah, they really fumbled though that they didn't show his shame room too in TB and just made him a cheerleader

silverBruise_322025-10-07 22:03

Yeah, that would have been the perfect place to address that

DCangst2025-10-07 22:32

I don't see RG as brainwashed. He seemed eager and willing -- a true patriot of Russia. Later on, after Yelena and Natasha kind of laid into him (during the BW movie) and Dreykov betrayed him by sending him to prison, he started to come around. But it took all that for him to get there, and even then he longed for his past glory. Hell, he knew Yelena was Val's assassin and wanted to sign up himself.

Left_Maize8162025-10-08 20:21

I honestly don’t understand what happened to Alexei after the Ohio mission. During the mission and escape he seems competent and able to think clearly during stressful situations. Afterwards, he’s basically an idiot. Did they lobotomize him or something?